Unacceptable QF Communication, Mismanagement and Question on Customer Rights (QF1 23.12)

42 replies

Doubleplatinum Banned

Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer Platinum

Member since 07 Feb 2013

Total posts 431

People, Just as a fact: on that day 2 other aircrafts were diverted to AAN: An Air France B773 (AF662) and a Kenya Air B788 (KQ310).


In the Crown Plaza DXB on Xmas eve my wife met some pax from the affected AF flight: well guess what: AF organised busses from Dubai to pick up all Pax (incl luggage). AF pax had to remain in plane for “only” 2.5h before brought safely to Dubai Hotel. AF made clear that pax will have to stay overnight and be put on flights on 25.12 - just a reminder: QF pax had to wait for 9h on the plane, then let off, food was then available FOR PURCHASE (not provided as QF claims) and 5h later they flew to DXB where only then and there pax received news that they would have to stay overnight in Dubai. Why couldn’t QF notify pax earlier? Clearly the lady on QF hotline knew this already hours before, as she told me.

Although resources are understandingly extremely limited at AAN for such emergency, generally speaking QF knew long time before QF1 was actually diverted to AAN that there would be possible trouble as planes were circling around DXB for hours before QF1s actual landing. How come AF can manage and QF not??


It’s pointless to argue now about the “could haves & should haves” - please let let it be.

Bottom line it comes down to 3 things:


1) resources: how many resources is an airline willing to allocate to troubleshoot unexpected situations? QF did in this case (for QF1 and QF2, 9 and 10) a horrible job, and clearly prioritises “no expenses & no responsibilities” before “customer first / help” (just read recent Qantas Twitter replies about HOW MANY passengers are frustrated with QF’s incompetency - waiting for 5h at LHR no info whatsoever from ground staff)


2) communication: QF should have tweeted or informed the public in some other way, in a PROACTIVE and TIMELY fashion that flight was diverted and long delays are to be expected. I think people would have still been angry but at least could adjust their expectations & hopes that they will miss Xmas (it’s called “expectation management” btw qf); and


3) Apologetic: it would go a long way to send at least an automated email to affected pax with something like: “we sincerely apologise for the experienced delay / flight cancellation, but unfortunately it was outside of our control. We would love to greet you on board soon!”


In summary Qantas has failed completely in managing this situation and showing decency. Proactive communication and an apology would have cost QF 0 cents but would have helped tons. IMO QF is too arrogant to take responsibility, communicate clearly and show customers respect. If this would happen with some ultra low cost carrier I would not complain but I really find it unacceptable from an airline which charges a premium.


I and approx 1000+ other pax simply feel let down by Qantas. At least this has been mentioned on the news. Lets hope QF (and the airline industry) learns from this fiasco and we don't ever have to see a person with Parkinson's disease being trapped on a plane for 23hrs+

Last edited by Johnny9 at Dec 27, 2017, 08.28 AM.


Yeah because Qantas could have magically known that a patient with parkinsons was on board? If someone with this disease cant handle a delay they shouldn't be flying full stop, just like parents who think they deserve special treatment because they have kids.

I have kids and don't feel I deserve special treatment, but would love for you to sit next to my three year old when she is Hangry!
Last edited by lobby at Dec 29, 2017, 03.04 PM.

Clearly needs some discipline, it's funny how it's always aussie kids on aircraft and lounges who are the noisy misbehaved ratbags annoying other passengers usually because their parents are too lazy to actually parent. Check asian kids on an Singapore flight they are always well behaved. Nothing to do with hungry, all about discipline.

Steve987

Member since 23 Feb 2015

Total posts 268

OP - be happy that your partner got on the ground safely.


DP - always great to see some casual racism make its way into a thread, kudos.

Doubleplatinum Banned

Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer Platinum

Member since 07 Feb 2013

Total posts 431

OP - be happy that your partner got on the ground safely.

DP - always great to see some casual racism make its way into a thread, kudos.

Casual rascism? By stating a well known fact? And the fact I am an Aussie? Drunk already when posting yesterday I'm guessing.

Steve987

Member since 23 Feb 2015

Total posts 268

OP - be happy that your partner got on the ground safely.

DP - always great to see some casual racism make its way into a thread, kudos.

Casual rascism? By stating a well known fact? And the fact I am an Aussie? Drunk already when posting yesterday I'm guessing.

Opinion stated as fact, followed by guesswork. Here's to you staying true to form in 2018!

Doubleplatinum Banned

Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer Platinum

Member since 07 Feb 2013

Total posts 431

OP - be happy that your partner got on the ground safely.

DP - always great to see some casual racism make its way into a thread, kudos.

Casual rascism? By stating a well known fact? And the fact I am an Aussie? Drunk already when posting yesterday I'm guessing.

Opinion stated as fact, followed by guesswork. Here's to you staying true to form in 2018!

If you think that is an opinion stated as fact you clearly don't travel often.

User

Member since 01 Jan 1970

Total posts 0

I agree it would be frustrating but I believe some of these issues result from practical difficulties and miscommunication as between QF teams in Australia, local ground staff (who may not be QF employees), and/or QF duty and/or replacement crews. I am no champion of QF customer service (after all, I refer to QF customer service as "excuse generation team"), but as anyone who has been stranded at LHR due to fog knows that even at one of the world's biggest and busiest airports and perhaps the airline's own hub, all of the above frustrations would still arise ... let alone at AAN.

User

Member since 01 Jan 1970

Total posts 0

People, Just as a fact: on that day 2 other aircrafts were diverted to AAN: An Air France B773 (AF662) and a Kenya Air B788 (KQ310).


In the Crown Plaza DXB on Xmas eve my wife met some pax from the affected AF flight: well guess what: AF organised busses from Dubai to pick up all Pax (incl luggage). AF pax had to remain in plane for “only” 2.5h before brought safely to Dubai Hotel. AF made clear that pax will have to stay overnight and be put on flights on 25.12 - just a reminder: QF pax had to wait for 9h on the plane, then let off, food was then available FOR PURCHASE (not provided as QF claims) and 5h later they flew to DXB where only then and there pax received news that they would have to stay overnight in Dubai. Why couldn’t QF notify pax earlier? Clearly the lady on QF hotline knew this already hours before, as she told me.

Although resources are understandingly extremely limited at AAN for such emergency, generally speaking QF knew long time before QF1 was actually diverted to AAN that there would be possible trouble as planes were circling around DXB for hours before QF1s actual landing. How come AF can manage and QF not??


It’s pointless to argue now about the “could haves & should haves” - please let let it be.

Bottom line it comes down to 3 things:


1) resources: how many resources is an airline willing to allocate to troubleshoot unexpected situations? QF did in this case (for QF1 and QF2, 9 and 10) a horrible job, and clearly prioritises “no expenses & no responsibilities” before “customer first / help” (just read recent Qantas Twitter replies about HOW MANY passengers are frustrated with QF’s incompetency - waiting for 5h at LHR no info whatsoever from ground staff)


2) communication: QF should have tweeted or informed the public in some other way, in a PROACTIVE and TIMELY fashion that flight was diverted and long delays are to be expected. I think people would have still been angry but at least could adjust their expectations & hopes that they will miss Xmas (it’s called “expectation management” btw qf); and


3) Apologetic: it would go a long way to send at least an automated email to affected pax with something like: “we sincerely apologise for the experienced delay / flight cancellation, but unfortunately it was outside of our control. We would love to greet you on board soon!”


In summary Qantas has failed completely in managing this situation and showing decency. Proactive communication and an apology would have cost QF 0 cents but would have helped tons. IMO QF is too arrogant to take responsibility, communicate clearly and show customers respect. If this would happen with some ultra low cost carrier I would not complain but I really find it unacceptable from an airline which charges a premium.


I and approx 1000+ other pax simply feel let down by Qantas. At least this has been mentioned on the news. Lets hope QF (and the airline industry) learns from this fiasco and we don't ever have to see a person with Parkinson's disease being trapped on a plane for 23hrs+

Last edited by Johnny9 at Dec 27, 2017, 08.28 AM.


Yeah because Qantas could have magically known that a patient with parkinsons was on board? If someone with this disease cant handle a delay they shouldn't be flying full stop, just like parents who think they deserve special treatment because they have kids.

I have kids and don't feel I deserve special treatment, but would love for you to sit next to my three year old when she is Hangry!
Last edited by lobby at Dec 29, 2017, 03.04 PM.

Clearly needs some discipline, it's funny how it's always aussie kids on aircraft and lounges who are the noisy misbehaved ratbags annoying other passengers usually because their parents are too lazy to actually parent. Check asian kids on an Singapore flight they are always well behaved. Nothing to do with hungry, all about discipline.

I do not care whether the above is characterised as facts or opinions or opinions masquerading as facts. What I do care is the racial stereotypes that are just plain wrong. Before I am challenged on the basis of how often I fly, I am more than happy to count flights against anyone as I fly multiple flights per week and hold platinum-level or equivalent status in more than one airline for over a decade and a half. There is no shortage of totally out-of-control Asian kids and perfectly behaved white kids on flights I have been on. I agree it is about discipline, but it has nothing to do with culture or race.

cderrick

Member since 10 Apr 2012

Total posts 1

Ok so I have read all the feeds on this.


Let me tell you first-hand what it was like as I was on that flight and had to endure the delay and then the debacle at DBX when we finally got off the plane.


We were given no food while on the ground at Al Ain. I asked for a soft drink (I got a cup of water) and was told by the outgoing crew that they could not open the bar. When the new crew arrived, I watched them open everything and walk down the aisles with whatever food and drink they could lay their hands on.

The outgoing crew that had just worked 24 hours straight were not off loaded and sat with the passengers at the back of economy and had to endure the wait with the rest of us. The Captain & flight crew stayed and made sure we all arrived in DBX.


BUT... what was most upsetting was seeing a privileged few (who had set up camp in the upstairs lounge) who obviously knew the crew, being fed cheese and fruit while the rest of us go bottled water and pre-packaged croissant


We all knew that something was up because whilst waiting in the terminal at Al Ain our Qantas app started telling us we had new flight details.


DBX was a sham... an utter disgrace.... 100's of tired and hungry passenger and only 3 Qantas ground staff on hand. they were amazing and patient but clearly crumbing under the pressure of trying to find seats on planes and organise accommodation for not just QF1 but other cancelled QF flights.


Oh... and the luggage? I was in the EU for 7 days leaving on QF2 on the 30/12.... I got a phone call from BA Luggage on the evening of the 29th saying my bags had arrived and I could pick them up on the 30th. So, I did just that and walked them back across to terminal 3 and checked them back in for the flight home. (A flight that got diverted to Melbourne for fuel)


QF2 on 30/12 we recognised each other, reminisced on our QF1 flight and shared war stories of missing luggage and rebooked flights. The crew were brilliant making sure we were comfortable and looked after us as valuable customers.


Now I am off to spend a few hours trying to lodge my insurance claim for lost connecting flights, lost prepaid accommodation and meals and a claim for 7 days with no clothes.


I could be bitter and twisted and honestly did consider moving my loyalty but now I have had time to calm down and reflect on an adventure that I would not have had if it hadn't had been for the Dubai fog.... besides now I can say I have been to Al Ain :-)

MikeZ

Member since 24 Jan 2017

Total posts 26

I’ve been in the similar situation with SQ in Moscow. 7 hours on the ground in addition to 12 hours flight, missed connection to Sydney etc. SQ is blacklisted to me since that. I beleive it is normal to expect an airline care more for the passengers and also some form of compensation (business class upgrades and ff points). In my case non of these have been done. So I would tell about my experience as much as I can and avoid the airline.

MikeZ

Member since 24 Jan 2017

Total posts 26

Please let us know how it goes with compensation. Have you send them email/posted on social media?

SteveCF

Virgin Australia - Velocity Rewards

Member since 15 Aug 2012

Total posts 67

I actually can't get over the armchair CEOs sitting here coming up with solutions. Let's put it this way, if it were all that easy, they would have done it.

I mean chartering an airline right then and there, bringing aircraft stairs down from Dubai, crew carrying catering for 450 people or just jumping on ol' Uber Eats Al Ain and ordering in pizza for 450 people...seriously guys.

Totally agree.

This would have cost qantas significant amount of money and they would have been doing everything possible to resolve the issue. I bet the lack of communication had a lot to do with not having any information to pass on in the first place.

Thats air travel, things happen, it's happened to me but you have to just ride the bumps.

I reckon AUSBT should do a q &a article with qantas and ask what can and can't be done in these situations.

kanga9999

Member since 09 Apr 2017

Total posts 61

I was on the QF2 flight out of LHR on the 23rd of December. We too were diverted from Dubai, due to the fog and the lack of fuel to be circling for the minimum 2.5 hours predicted. We went to DWC and sat on the tarmac for a number of hours before heading back to Dubai for the crew change and plane refueling etc. Our departure was delayed at Dubai for a couple of hours too, and we ended up landing about 6-7 hours late into Sydney on Christmas Day, the pilot/s on the Dubai -> Sydney leg making up as much time as they could.

I had a different experience to that of the OP's wife. Yes, it was a much shorter delay, but more importantly the communication from the Qantas flight deck crew and cabin crew was brilliant. We were constantly kept informed, on the approach to Dubai, when the decision to stop circling was made, while on the tarmac at DWC - where we got a fuel top-up - and as we finally arrived at Dubai. And that really does go a long way to appeasing passengers, even if the update is just to say they they don't know how much longer the delay will be. While we didn't get any food while on the tarmac at DWC (that I remember) we did get plenty of water. And the cabin crew of this short haul flight, were rapidly heading into long haul hours, but remained cheerful and helpful within the obvious constraints.

The delay at Dubai was not explained and that was a bit annoying, especially after the Qantas crew had been so good, but given the chaos with so many flights disrupted, it is not surprising in hindsight. I only saw one passenger acting out in frustration, and that was when going back through Dubai security when leaving. He was quickly shut down by other passengers because obviously it was not Dubai airport security's fault, and the outburst may have had more to do with the man being sprung attempting to bring a couple of bottles of duty free through in his cabin luggage. Bluster that didn't fool anyone, and totally unfair the the female security person who discovered the bottles.

The second leg, as mentioned, was as fast as they could make it, and we were again kept informed, including the news that the staff in Sydney were busy rescheduling ongoing flights for those who had missed connections. This being spoken of so early in the flight home was much appreciated and when on approach they listed the HUGE number of flights that were rescheduled, you knew that there were quite a number of staff in Sydney whose Xmas was being disrupted too.

Also to be noted, there were a number of passengers who were having to make overnight stays in Sydney or New Zealand due to not making their original connections. Qantas booked those passengers into hotels (and presumably paid for them) which, given the fog was well beyond their control, was probably not something that they had to do. As a VERY modest shareholder of Qantas stock, I totally approve of the way they dealt with this fraught situation. Passengers before profit.

And finally, after getting off the plane in Sydney, there were at least a dozen Qantas staff members at the gate ready to offer assistance.

I'm not sure that Qantas could have done any better.

Johnny9

Member since 05 Aug 2017

Total posts 54

Nice to see some repeated and recent news coverage on this “flight from hell”. Btw I’m still waiting for an apology from qantas.

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