Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
I think you are only looking at lockdowns with a closed mindset. They do not always stop the spread. But they always cause devastation to millions of people. people are starving just so some can say there are zero cases. People are committing suicide through losing their businesses. Marriages are wrecked, children are storing up massive mental health issues all so some health expert can say there are zero cases. It's madness. Sure, have some simple controls. Make masks mandatory as they are in Hong Kong. Even little kids wear masks there. They have no problem at all and have never locked down. They put simple restrictions in place and over the last 6 months they get a few small amount of cases but no lockdown. We can follow the same path. Australia is one country. No border closures, allow interstate travel, keep simple restrictions in place but no need to lockdown. There is a balance which can be achieved.
Richard in Australia the devastation is not quite as dire unemployment is back to 2019 levels bankruptcies are down housing prices are booming. There are mental health issues but not dramatic. Then again the mental health issues with higher covid cases need to be factored in. My point is shorter sharper and earlier lockdowns do work: see SA and WA
“ Thank goodness we have sensible states like QLD, NT and Vic.”
To be honest, my opinion of these states makes me wonder if you are being sarcastic, as I strongly disagree with this statement, but hey, horses for courses as long as we stick to established facts and figures, then we can agree to disagree civilly.
(BTW I am not asking you or anyone to justify this statement as each of us have different perspectives and outlook and risk tolerance)
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
I think you are only looking at lockdowns with a closed mindset. They do not always stop the spread. But they always cause devastation to millions of people. people are starving just so some can say there are zero cases. People are committing suicide through losing their businesses. Marriages are wrecked, children are storing up massive mental health issues all so some health expert can say there are zero cases. It's madness. Sure, have some simple controls. Make masks mandatory as they are in Hong Kong. Even little kids wear masks there. They have no problem at all and have never locked down. They put simple restrictions in place and over the last 6 months they get a few small amount of cases but no lockdown. We can follow the same path. Australia is one country. No border closures, allow interstate travel, keep simple restrictions in place but no need to lockdown. There is a balance which can be achieved.
Richard in Australia the devastation is not quite as dire unemployment is back to 2019 levels bankruptcies are down housing prices are booming. There are mental health issues but not dramatic. Then again the mental health issues with higher covid cases need to be factored in. My point is shorter sharper and earlier lockdowns do work: see SA and WA
How long should we keep having lockdowns?
That's easy: when most of us are vaccinated and the Federal Government dawdling on this hasn't helped but hopefully by the end of the year. A few months after everybody else
“ Thank goodness we have sensible states like QLD, NT and Vic.”
To be honest, my opinion of these states makes me wonder if you are being sarcastic, as I strongly disagree with this statement, but hey, horses for courses as long as we stick to established facts and figures, then we can agree to disagree civilly.
(BTW I am not asking you or anyone to justify this statement as each of us have different perspectives and outlook and risk tolerance)
Xwu I would add SA to that list: the short sharp lockdown has been very effective as has NZs approach. Victoria has been tool slow with lockdowns, so they went on for too long.
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
I think you are only looking at lockdowns with a closed mindset. They do not always stop the spread. But they always cause devastation to millions of people. people are starving just so some can say there are zero cases. People are committing suicide through losing their businesses. Marriages are wrecked, children are storing up massive mental health issues all so some health expert can say there are zero cases. It's madness. Sure, have some simple controls. Make masks mandatory as they are in Hong Kong. Even little kids wear masks there. They have no problem at all and have never locked down. They put simple restrictions in place and over the last 6 months they get a few small amount of cases but no lockdown. We can follow the same path. Australia is one country. No border closures, allow interstate travel, keep simple restrictions in place but no need to lockdown. There is a balance which can be achieved.
Richard in Australia the devastation is not quite as dire unemployment is back to 2019 levels bankruptcies are down housing prices are booming. There are mental health issues but not dramatic. Then again the mental health issues with higher covid cases need to be factored in. My point is shorter sharper and earlier lockdowns do work: see SA and WA
How long should we keep having lockdowns?
That's easy: when most of us are vaccinated and the Federal Government dawdling on this hasn't helped but hopefully by the end of the year. A few months after everybody else
Most of the population will not get vaccinated. They choose not to do so. How long should we keep having lockdowns?
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
I think you are only looking at lockdowns with a closed mindset. They do not always stop the spread. But they always cause devastation to millions of people. people are starving just so some can say there are zero cases. People are committing suicide through losing their businesses. Marriages are wrecked, children are storing up massive mental health issues all so some health expert can say there are zero cases. It's madness. Sure, have some simple controls. Make masks mandatory as they are in Hong Kong. Even little kids wear masks there. They have no problem at all and have never locked down. They put simple restrictions in place and over the last 6 months they get a few small amount of cases but no lockdown. We can follow the same path. Australia is one country. No border closures, allow interstate travel, keep simple restrictions in place but no need to lockdown. There is a balance which can be achieved.
Richard in Australia the devastation is not quite as dire unemployment is back to 2019 levels bankruptcies are down housing prices are booming. There are mental health issues but not dramatic. Then again the mental health issues with higher covid cases need to be factored in. My point is shorter sharper and earlier lockdowns do work: see SA and WA
How long should we keep having lockdowns?
That's easy: when most of us are vaccinated and the Federal Government dawdling on this hasn't helped but hopefully by the end of the year. A few months after everybody else
Most of the population will not get vaccinated. They choose not to do so. How long should we keep having lockdowns?
Like most of your comments your figures are also just plain false. Just because you are gullible enough to believe conspiracy theories, thankfully most of the rest of the country isn't.
Unfortunately my comments are not conspiracy theories but reality. As of today only 2.8% of the population of Australia are fully vaccinated. 23.91% have had at least one dose. Right now, most of the population do not want to have the vaccine. I will.
So. How long should we keep having lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Simple question.
“Xwu I would add SA to that list: the short sharp lockdown has been very effective as has NZs approach. Victoria has been tool slow with lockdowns, so they went on for too long.“
Just to be clear, lockdown and border restriction/closure are separate matters and by different states on either side of the outbreak, although related in a roundabout way.
Flyman and I are talking about border restrictions or interstate travel restrictions which is the header of this forum, not lockdown.
Just pointing out that every outbreak in one state resulted in 5-6 different responses from other states. Every single time.
The way that some state government(s) react over the last 16 months, with that kind of risk tolerance, they don't really need a healthcare professional to tell them to close borders to a hint of a community spread (but they will need one such professional to take responsibility when they want to reopen).
Note someone went to NZ in the bubble and spread the bug there. Gladys big mistake was not to have an immediate lockdown for a couple of days while they tracked people down like they did in SA. Now it is too late so another month or so of closed borders. As we are seeing the latest version of the bug is quite infectious.
I totally support the position that Gladys maintains. The madness of lockdowns needs to end sometime. WA and Queensland can wait for 10 years if they wish before opening their borders completely. At that time the virus will just come in. Wait 100 years if they wish and what will they gain? The virus will always come back. Lockdowns are not the answer. There are plenty of other answers to combat a virus which still only really affects people over the age of 80.
We have to come to the stage at some point very soon, that we cant continue to lock the country down, we are having isolated flare ups that are generally managed well, and last time I looked at the Woke press, people were not dying in the streets in there 1000's. 99.9% or there about tested for COVID dont have it. So fact a lot of Australians will not feel the need to have a vaccine. Consider this. you can have the vaccine now but will still have to quarantine for 2 weeks, or not have it and still quarantine for 2 weeks. You could be negative on arrival to AU you could even do a lateral flow test every day ( note this test is now approved by the Australian drug/medical board ) and be negative everyday you test but still you are behind bars. No one in there right mind will come here if they have to have a vaccine and still quarantine for 2 weeks, be that in a hotel or at home. This talk of letting 1000's of OS students in to help the Universities out is unbelievable, why on earth are we not getting our own people back first.
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
I think you are only looking at lockdowns with a closed mindset. They do not always stop the spread. But they always cause devastation to millions of people. people are starving just so some can say there are zero cases. People are committing suicide through losing their businesses. Marriages are wrecked, children are storing up massive mental health issues all so some health expert can say there are zero cases. It's madness. Sure, have some simple controls. Make masks mandatory as they are in Hong Kong. Even little kids wear masks there. They have no problem at all and have never locked down. They put simple restrictions in place and over the last 6 months they get a few small amount of cases but no lockdown. We can follow the same path. Australia is one country. No border closures, allow interstate travel, keep simple restrictions in place but no need to lockdown. There is a balance which can be achieved.
Richard in Australia the devastation is not quite as dire unemployment is back to 2019 levels bankruptcies are down housing prices are booming. There are mental health issues but not dramatic. Then again the mental health issues with higher covid cases need to be factored in. My point is shorter sharper and earlier lockdowns do work: see SA and WA
How long should we keep having lockdowns?
That's easy: when most of us are vaccinated and the Federal Government dawdling on this hasn't helped but hopefully by the end of the year. A few months after everybody else
Most of the population will not get vaccinated. They choose not to do so. How long should we keep having lockdowns?
Like most of your comments your figures are also just plain false. Just because you are gullible enough to believe conspiracy theories, thankfully most of the rest of the country isn't.
Unfortunately my comments are not conspiracy theories but reality. As of today only 2.8% of the population of Australia are fully vaccinated. 23.91% have had at least one dose. Right now, most of the population do not want to have the vaccine. I will.
So. How long should we keep having lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Simple question.
Richard the latest survey suggest that most do: around 70% will or are likely to, much in line with other countries. Not sure where ‘most do not’ comes from.
Take this with a pinch of salt as I don’t pretend to be a fly on the wall in those National Cabinet (and whatever they call it before it) meetings so I am plainly speculating the following out of some presumption:
1. Maybe it’s federal responsibility to quarantine arrivals (maybe not, the politicking states say it’s federal, commonwealth no comments), but it is clear that commonwealth does not have resources (accomodation, medical, security) on the ground in major arrival ports in March 2020 to set up quarantine facilities.
2. Federal ask states to take care of it and run it, states agree with no end date specified at the time, as they did not think it would be more than a year and obviously it will take at least 6 months for federal to build anything proper as well as the fact the hotel industry died when the international borders shut and so did interstate travel mid 2020.
3. All participating states decide to use hotel quarantine and there is enough exisiting accomodation (and hoteliers lining to sign up to keep opening) to run them
4. The international arrivals are getting into increased volume and after mid 2020, quarantine capacity are limited (and hotel start to drop out or found not to be suitable for quarantine) not helped by JobKeeper scheme which allows zombie workforce on the payroll, hence a cap was introduced possibly at the request of the states
5. Federal agree to having the cap but the actual numbers of cap arrival is determined by the participating states NOT federal, ie the commonwealth did not say let’s have 5000 international arrival per week and who wants to take them
6. States discover that many quarantine travellers did not pay their bill and almost all outbreaks since May 2020 can be traced to hotel quarantine so they do not want to be involved and also more hotels are getting out of the scheme rather than put up with media associations with outbreak sites, so some participating states (not all) are saying federal needs to build dedicated facilities.
7. States reliant on international students realised if they don’t restart the international education industry (its money and cheap skilled labour, forget about cultural exchange, international relationship, blah blah) they definitely will not get the China and India market return with pre COVID-19 volume and so they want to restart this outside the caps. Frankly the additional volume requested by individual states for their own University within their states does not significantly affect the Aussie arrivals (I suspect the true arrivals numbers does not go anywhere near 90% of the caps of each state)
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
I think you are only looking at lockdowns with a closed mindset. They do not always stop the spread. But they always cause devastation to millions of people. people are starving just so some can say there are zero cases. People are committing suicide through losing their businesses. Marriages are wrecked, children are storing up massive mental health issues all so some health expert can say there are zero cases. It's madness. Sure, have some simple controls. Make masks mandatory as they are in Hong Kong. Even little kids wear masks there. They have no problem at all and have never locked down. They put simple restrictions in place and over the last 6 months they get a few small amount of cases but no lockdown. We can follow the same path. Australia is one country. No border closures, allow interstate travel, keep simple restrictions in place but no need to lockdown. There is a balance which can be achieved.
Richard in Australia the devastation is not quite as dire unemployment is back to 2019 levels bankruptcies are down housing prices are booming. There are mental health issues but not dramatic. Then again the mental health issues with higher covid cases need to be factored in. My point is shorter sharper and earlier lockdowns do work: see SA and WA
How long should we keep having lockdowns?
That's easy: when most of us are vaccinated and the Federal Government dawdling on this hasn't helped but hopefully by the end of the year. A few months after everybody else
Most of the population will not get vaccinated. They choose not to do so. How long should we keep having lockdowns?
Like most of your comments your figures are also just plain false. Just because you are gullible enough to believe conspiracy theories, thankfully most of the rest of the country isn't.
Unfortunately my comments are not conspiracy theories but reality. As of today only 2.8% of the population of Australia are fully vaccinated. 23.91% have had at least one dose. Right now, most of the population do not want to have the vaccine. I will.
So. How long should we keep having lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Simple question.
Richard the latest survey suggest that most do: around 70% will or are likely to, much in line with other countries. Not sure where ‘most do not’ comes from.
I look at survey results as well and certainly do not see 70% as a likely number. Today I read that only 30% of aged care workers are vaccinated. If ever any cohort should be vaccinated it is people working in aged care. And they have been at the front of the queue so no lack of vaccine doses has distorted this number. If we get 50% of the population vaccinated it will be an achievement.
So. Again I ask the question. How long should we have lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Let me give you a different potential answer. No lockdowns apply to anyone who is fully vaccinated.
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
I think you are only looking at lockdowns with a closed mindset. They do not always stop the spread. But they always cause devastation to millions of people. people are starving just so some can say there are zero cases. People are committing suicide through losing their businesses. Marriages are wrecked, children are storing up massive mental health issues all so some health expert can say there are zero cases. It's madness. Sure, have some simple controls. Make masks mandatory as they are in Hong Kong. Even little kids wear masks there. They have no problem at all and have never locked down. They put simple restrictions in place and over the last 6 months they get a few small amount of cases but no lockdown. We can follow the same path. Australia is one country. No border closures, allow interstate travel, keep simple restrictions in place but no need to lockdown. There is a balance which can be achieved.
Richard in Australia the devastation is not quite as dire unemployment is back to 2019 levels bankruptcies are down housing prices are booming. There are mental health issues but not dramatic. Then again the mental health issues with higher covid cases need to be factored in. My point is shorter sharper and earlier lockdowns do work: see SA and WA
How long should we keep having lockdowns?
That's easy: when most of us are vaccinated and the Federal Government dawdling on this hasn't helped but hopefully by the end of the year. A few months after everybody else
Most of the population will not get vaccinated. They choose not to do so. How long should we keep having lockdowns?
Like most of your comments your figures are also just plain false. Just because you are gullible enough to believe conspiracy theories, thankfully most of the rest of the country isn't.
Unfortunately my comments are not conspiracy theories but reality. As of today only 2.8% of the population of Australia are fully vaccinated. 23.91% have had at least one dose. Right now, most of the population do not want to have the vaccine. I will.
So. How long should we keep having lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Simple question.
Richard the latest survey suggest that most do: around 70% will or are likely to, much in line with other countries. Not sure where ‘most do not’ comes from.
I look at survey results as well and certainly do not see 70% as a likely number. Today I read that only 30% of aged care workers are vaccinated. If ever any cohort should be vaccinated it is people working in aged care. And they have been at the front of the queue so no lack of vaccine doses has distorted this number. If we get 50% of the population vaccinated it will be an achievement.
So. Again I ask the question. How long should we have lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Let me give you a different potential answer. No lockdowns apply to anyone who is fully vaccinated.
Richard a Sydney University survey dated May 10 shows 66% would have a jab and a further 30% are undecided. Here is the link https://www.sydney.edu.au/news-opinion/news/2021/05/10/australians-support-mandatory-covid-19-vaccine-survey.html
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
I think you are only looking at lockdowns with a closed mindset. They do not always stop the spread. But they always cause devastation to millions of people. people are starving just so some can say there are zero cases. People are committing suicide through losing their businesses. Marriages are wrecked, children are storing up massive mental health issues all so some health expert can say there are zero cases. It's madness. Sure, have some simple controls. Make masks mandatory as they are in Hong Kong. Even little kids wear masks there. They have no problem at all and have never locked down. They put simple restrictions in place and over the last 6 months they get a few small amount of cases but no lockdown. We can follow the same path. Australia is one country. No border closures, allow interstate travel, keep simple restrictions in place but no need to lockdown. There is a balance which can be achieved.
Richard in Australia the devastation is not quite as dire unemployment is back to 2019 levels bankruptcies are down housing prices are booming. There are mental health issues but not dramatic. Then again the mental health issues with higher covid cases need to be factored in. My point is shorter sharper and earlier lockdowns do work: see SA and WA
How long should we keep having lockdowns?
That's easy: when most of us are vaccinated and the Federal Government dawdling on this hasn't helped but hopefully by the end of the year. A few months after everybody else
Most of the population will not get vaccinated. They choose not to do so. How long should we keep having lockdowns?
Like most of your comments your figures are also just plain false. Just because you are gullible enough to believe conspiracy theories, thankfully most of the rest of the country isn't.
Unfortunately my comments are not conspiracy theories but reality. As of today only 2.8% of the population of Australia are fully vaccinated. 23.91% have had at least one dose. Right now, most of the population do not want to have the vaccine. I will.
So. How long should we keep having lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Simple question.
Richard the latest survey suggest that most do: around 70% will or are likely to, much in line with other countries. Not sure where ‘most do not’ comes from.
I look at survey results as well and certainly do not see 70% as a likely number. Today I read that only 30% of aged care workers are vaccinated. If ever any cohort should be vaccinated it is people working in aged care. And they have been at the front of the queue so no lack of vaccine doses has distorted this number. If we get 50% of the population vaccinated it will be an achievement.
So. Again I ask the question. How long should we have lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Let me give you a different potential answer. No lockdowns apply to anyone who is fully vaccinated.
Richard a Sydney University survey dated May 10 shows 66% would have a jab and a further 30% are undecided. Here is the link https://www.sydney.edu.au/news-opinion/news/2021/05/10/australians-support-mandatory-covid-19-vaccine-survey.html
What do you want to believe in? A hopeful prediction or actual reality backed up by hard facts right now? Only 30% of front line aged care workers are vaccinated. The two 60 year olds at the dry cleaners who became infected from Sydney are not vaccinated. All these people are at the front of the queue for being eligible to be vaccinated. They chose not to do so. By the time we even get close to 50%, new strains will mean different vaccines will be needed. So again I ask, how long should we stay in lock down and pausing Interstate travel?
@ Patrick the just because the entire country has been Vaccinated does not mean the government will re-open borders - my original hope was the same as yours in that once the majority of the population were to be vaccinated fully then borders would re-open but it doesn't appear to be the case hence no assurance or road map from the federal government on this matter.
If you don't believe me or think I am making this off please refer to the quote below - if you search the quote online it will take you to numerous news articles herald sun, news.com.au etc - Scott Morrison has confirmed this on Sunrise 2 days ago.
The Prime Minister has issued a stern reality check to Australians hoping high vaccination rates will mean reopened borders.
I can't paste the link as this site does not allow external news sites to be posted.
@ Patrick the just because the entire country has been Vaccinated does not mean the government will re-open borders - my original hope was the same as yours in that once the majority of the population were to be vaccinated fully then borders would re-open but it doesn't appear to be the case hence no assurance or road map from the federal government on this matter.
If you don't believe me or think I am making this off please refer to the quote below - if you search the quote online it will take you to numerous news articles herald sun, news.com.au etc - Scott Morrison has confirmed this on Sunrise 2 days ago.
The Prime Minister has issued a stern reality check to Australians hoping high vaccination rates will mean reopened borders.
Richard W
Richard W
Singapore Airlines - KrisFlyer
Member since 12 Apr 2017
Total posts 88
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
XWu
XWu
Member since 09 May 2020
Total posts 197
@Flyman
“ Thank goodness we have sensible states like QLD, NT and Vic.”
To be honest, my opinion of these states makes me wonder if you are being sarcastic, as I strongly disagree with this statement, but hey, horses for courses as long as we stick to established facts and figures, then we can agree to disagree civilly.
(BTW I am not asking you or anyone to justify this statement as each of us have different perspectives and outlook and risk tolerance)
patrickk
patrickk
Qantas
Member since 19 Apr 2012
Total posts 731
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
patrickk
patrickk
Qantas
Member since 19 Apr 2012
Total posts 731
Originally Posted by XWu
@Flyman
“ Thank goodness we have sensible states like QLD, NT and Vic.”
To be honest, my opinion of these states makes me wonder if you are being sarcastic, as I strongly disagree with this statement, but hey, horses for courses as long as we stick to established facts and figures, then we can agree to disagree civilly.
(BTW I am not asking you or anyone to justify this statement as each of us have different perspectives and outlook and risk tolerance)
Richard W
Richard W
Singapore Airlines - KrisFlyer
Member since 12 Apr 2017
Total posts 88
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
Richard W
Richard W
Singapore Airlines - KrisFlyer
Member since 12 Apr 2017
Total posts 88
Originally Posted by tripleplatinum2
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
So. How long should we keep having lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Simple question.
XWu
XWu
Member since 09 May 2020
Total posts 197
@patrickk
“Xwu I would add SA to that list: the short sharp lockdown has been very effective as has NZs approach. Victoria has been tool slow with lockdowns, so they went on for too long.“
Just to be clear, lockdown and border restriction/closure are separate matters and by different states on either side of the outbreak, although related in a roundabout way.
Flyman and I are talking about border restrictions or interstate travel restrictions which is the header of this forum, not lockdown.
Just pointing out that every outbreak in one state resulted in 5-6 different responses from other states. Every single time.
The way that some state government(s) react over the last 16 months, with that kind of risk tolerance, they don't really need a healthcare professional to tell them to close borders to a hint of a community spread (but they will need one such professional to take responsibility when they want to reopen).
Juddy
Juddy
Member since 25 Jun 2021
Total posts 20
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Note someone went to NZ in the bubble and spread the bug there. Gladys big mistake was not to have an immediate lockdown for a couple of days while they tracked people down like they did in SA. Now it is too late so another month or so of closed borders. As we are seeing the latest version of the bug is quite infectious.
patrickk
patrickk
Qantas
Member since 19 Apr 2012
Total posts 731
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by tripleplatinum2
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
So. How long should we keep having lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Simple question.
XWu
XWu
Member since 09 May 2020
Total posts 197
@Juddy
Take this with a pinch of salt as I don’t pretend to be a fly on the wall in those National Cabinet (and whatever they call it before it) meetings so I am plainly speculating the following out of some presumption:
1. Maybe it’s federal responsibility to quarantine arrivals (maybe not, the politicking states say it’s federal, commonwealth no comments), but it is clear that commonwealth does not have resources (accomodation, medical, security) on the ground in major arrival ports in March 2020 to set up quarantine facilities.
2. Federal ask states to take care of it and run it, states agree with no end date specified at the time, as they did not think it would be more than a year and obviously it will take at least 6 months for federal to build anything proper as well as the fact the hotel industry died when the international borders shut and so did interstate travel mid 2020.
3. All participating states decide to use hotel quarantine and there is enough exisiting accomodation (and hoteliers lining to sign up to keep opening) to run them
4. The international arrivals are getting into increased volume and after mid 2020, quarantine capacity are limited (and hotel start to drop out or found not to be suitable for quarantine) not helped by JobKeeper scheme which allows zombie workforce on the payroll, hence a cap was introduced possibly at the request of the states
5. Federal agree to having the cap but the actual numbers of cap arrival is determined by the participating states NOT federal, ie the commonwealth did not say let’s have 5000 international arrival per week and who wants to take them
6. States discover that many quarantine travellers did not pay their bill and almost all outbreaks since May 2020 can be traced to hotel quarantine so they do not want to be involved and also more hotels are getting out of the scheme rather than put up with media associations with outbreak sites, so some participating states (not all) are saying federal needs to build dedicated facilities.
7. States reliant on international students realised if they don’t restart the international education industry (its money and cheap skilled labour, forget about cultural exchange, international relationship, blah blah) they definitely will not get the China and India market return with pre COVID-19 volume and so they want to restart this outside the caps. Frankly the additional volume requested by individual states for their own University within their states does not significantly affect the Aussie arrivals (I suspect the true arrivals numbers does not go anywhere near 90% of the caps of each state)
Richard W
Richard W
Singapore Airlines - KrisFlyer
Member since 12 Apr 2017
Total posts 88
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by tripleplatinum2
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
So. How long should we keep having lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Simple question.
So. Again I ask the question. How long should we have lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Let me give you a different potential answer. No lockdowns apply to anyone who is fully vaccinated.
patrickk
patrickk
Qantas
Member since 19 Apr 2012
Total posts 731
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by tripleplatinum2
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
So. How long should we keep having lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Simple question.
So. Again I ask the question. How long should we have lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Let me give you a different potential answer. No lockdowns apply to anyone who is fully vaccinated.
Richard W
Richard W
Singapore Airlines - KrisFlyer
Member since 12 Apr 2017
Total posts 88
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by tripleplatinum2
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Originally Posted by Richard W
Originally Posted by patrickk
Richard I’m very pleased the government controls my health. They told me to get vaccinated 60 something years ago and generally looked after me ever since to varying degrees of effectiveness. They halve my doctors bills and probably more pharmacy bills and sometimes help out on hospital bills. Far more preferable to the over priced US system which seems to be your preference. I’m glad you didn’t exclude news reports. Yes lockdowns do work. Easy to check where they’ve been lifted too early to see what happened.
So. How long should we keep having lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Simple question.
So. Again I ask the question. How long should we have lockdowns and stop interstate travel? Let me give you a different potential answer. No lockdowns apply to anyone who is fully vaccinated.
Travellz
Travellz
Member since 26 Mar 2020
Total posts 55
@ Patrick the just because the entire country has been Vaccinated does not mean the government will re-open borders - my original hope was the same as yours in that once the majority of the population were to be vaccinated fully then borders would re-open but it doesn't appear to be the case hence no assurance or road map from the federal government on this matter.
If you don't believe me or think I am making this off please refer to the quote below - if you search the quote online it will take you to numerous news articles herald sun, news.com.au etc - Scott Morrison has confirmed this on Sunrise 2 days ago.
The Prime Minister has issued a stern reality check to Australians hoping high vaccination rates will mean reopened borders.
I can't paste the link as this site does not allow external news sites to be posted.
Travellz
Travellz
Member since 26 Mar 2020
Total posts 55
@ Patrick the just because the entire country has been Vaccinated does not mean the government will re-open borders - my original hope was the same as yours in that once the majority of the population were to be vaccinated fully then borders would re-open but it doesn't appear to be the case hence no assurance or road map from the federal government on this matter.
If you don't believe me or think I am making this off please refer to the quote below - if you search the quote online it will take you to numerous news articles herald sun, news.com.au etc - Scott Morrison has confirmed this on Sunrise 2 days ago.
The Prime Minister has issued a stern reality check to Australians hoping high vaccination rates will mean reopened borders.
https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-updates/health-safety/prime-minister-scott-morrison-warns-reopening-australias-borders-could-lead-to-5000-cases-a-day/news-story/2832e904c76766a10aa94dc4356b7ca2