Qantas to fly Boeing 717s between Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane
By David Flynn, June 9 2017
EXCLUSIVE | Qantas will fly its regional Boeing 717 jets between Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane on weekends starting from early August 2017, in replacing the larger Boeing 737-800 aircraft on selected flights.
The move is intended to reduce operating costs and 'right-size' the weekend fleet on these 'triangle' routes, which see much lower passenger numbers outside of peak hours across Saturday and Sunday compared to weekdays.
A Qantas spokesperson confirmed to Australian Business Traveller that "about 20 weekend flights in non-peak times" would progressively switch to the Boeing 717s of regional arm QantasLink starting Saturday August 5.
"Our strategy is to make sure we have the right aircraft on the right route. It’s a small change that impacts about 1% of our total weekend flying between Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane, but it shows our ability to adjust to meet the market and still maintain the same number of services."
Australian Business Traveller understands that eight flights or 'sectors' will be scheduled from August 5 with the remaining 12 sectors downgraded to the Boeing 717 from mid-August.
The nimble Boeing 717 carries just 110 passengers – including 12 in business class – compared to 174 on the Boeing 737s...
... with the airline's Q Streaming WiFi system serving up inflight music and video content.
The QantasLink fleet also includes some Boeing 717s in an all-economy layout of 125 seats, but these will remain on regional routes where there's less demand for business class.
There'll be no impact on availability of business class for those downsized triangle flights, as both the Boeing 717 and Boeing 737 each have 12 seats at the pointy end – although while legroom remains the same, the Boeing 717 seats are slightly narrower at 20 inches compared to 22 inches.
Economy class flyers may even prefer the smaller Boeing 717, where the cheap seats are wider (18 inches) and have more legroom due to greater pitch (31 inches) compared to the 17.2 inch width and 30 inch pitch of the Boeing 737 – as well as a 2-3 seating layout compared to the larger Boeing 737's 3-3 configuration.
David Flynn is the Editor-in-Chief of Executive Traveller and a bit of a travel tragic with a weakness for good coffee, shopping and lychee martinis.
Qantas
22 Oct 2012
Total posts 319
One has to ask why QF haven't done this earlier, in order to save costs and "right-size" their fleet. It was hardly a complex decision for them to make.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
14 Feb 2017
Total posts 25
You're right, but probably due to other competing or more pressing priorities i would suggest.
29 Aug 2013
Total posts 4
I guess it is probably 'cheaper' to park a 717 on the ground than a 737. Would be interesting to see how qantas intends to utilise the extra capacity freed up by this re-config.
24 Apr 2015
Total posts 128
so what are the 738's displaced going to do at these times on Sat/Sun?
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
20 Mar 2014
Total posts 132
they will get some much needed rest and playtime...
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 621
@ phily:
24 Apr 2015
Total posts 128
cos the economy is heading for the toilet. Property & retail are stuffed. Airlines can't give away seats long haul. Only yesterday, got an email from Scoot to say PERTH/ATHENS AUD$339 + FEW BUCKS FOR BAG & FOOD.
29 Jan 2012
Total posts 176
Totally agree!! Finally someone who sees where the global economy is going. Private, business and government sectors are all running on tick - and the axe is about to fall, hard. Airlines are already gearing up for the collapse with smaller aircraft fleets and airframe types to cater for the 50% plus possible fall in passenger loads in the next 5 - 10 yrs.
24 Apr 2015
Total posts 128
could some of the 738's be used to break the virtual VA/NZ monopoly on the BNE/ZQN route ? VA/NZ have up to a dozen or so services a week & operate year round. QF have 2 a week for only about 10 weeks a year.
Just looked at flying in August (15-20) & fare was over $1200 in economy return, while I could fly to LAX return in economy for less.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
20 Mar 2012
Total posts 233
I think you'll find food and baggage on the Athens flights add more than $200 each way. This means a return fare with food and baggage comes to over $1040 (on sale), which is around the same you can find sale fares on full service carriers.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
02 Apr 2017
Total posts 134
Actually, those $339 fares included food and baggage. They were FLYBAGEAT tickets.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
20 Mar 2012
Total posts 233
Unfortunately they were not, although it did look that way on the advertisements. The base sale fare was $339 and there was a promo code for a certain amount of flybageat too.
24 Apr 2015
Total posts 128
thing with LCC's ... you don't have to buy all the add ons. Many people can travel lightly, but don't when you give them 20-23kgs. Have gone to USA with 7 kgs only. Easy to do.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
25 May 2017
Total posts 79
Smart move by QF
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
16 Apr 2013
Total posts 30
The 2 class 717 are great to fly in. However, its really annoying when you think you are going to get nice 717 but then you get the single class "bus". This seems to happen quite a bit due to the maintenance requirements of these birds. I think Qantas needs to consider refurbishing the other 717s; at a very bare minimum Q streaming.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
02 Apr 2017
Total posts 134
I agree, it's one of the best craft in their fleet and its so underrated.
25 Sep 2013
Total posts 1245
Makes total sense.
28 Oct 2011
Total posts 650
QF is evolving and adjusting its aircraft (pax seating) to better fit demand during certain periods, weekends.AND QF also is great at up gauging domestic routes/flights during periods of high demand. VA is turning into a sole 737 domestic operator. No competition for QF.
24 Apr 2015
Total posts 128
don't forget VA are using Alliance F70 & F100's. I think Alliance have access to all the Austrian Fokker fleet. Thinking out side the box, surely a few Alliance jets could be configured with some business class seats up front & then VA could do the same as QF, use another airlines aircraft to fly the golden triangle when demand not there, but want to maintain frequency.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
17 Aug 2016
Total posts 23
All the 717s are operated by cobham air services and not qantas I feel for the staff who don't get paid the same or even get the same perks as to their fellow workers on the 737
28 Oct 2011
Total posts 650
All staff sign a contract, and have EBAs relevant to their position. If they don't like it, they can raise their concerns to their position.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
17 Aug 2016
Total posts 23
I don't work for them. Thank god. Have a great day.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
20 Aug 2014
Total posts 157
Bringing the most unreliable type in the fleet to the triangle route. Interesting.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
28 Oct 2011
Total posts 462
No, they're not using the A380s on those routes......
24 Aug 2011
Total posts 1209
This is probably just an example of how sluggish domestic travel currently is. Both VA and QF have excess capacity throughout their domestic fleets.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
12 Jun 2011
Total posts 148
VA's order of 737MAX aircraft is more to do with not having money for capital expenditure than capacity reduction. Better utilisation of their jets should mean little impact to their capacity (and Alliance is picking up a lot of the slack for TT).
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
21 Jan 2014
Total posts 321
The failure rate of these is quite high, cancelled services on the 717 far greater than other aircraft, TSV-BNE is a regular no show. Second is they tend to park the 717 away from the airbridges and a tarmac walk is a regular feature, we have family who can't use the stairs and find the folklift experience overwhelming so we fly them VA now if a 717 service is scheduled.
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 621
@CBRGB:
24 Apr 2015
Total posts 128
surely on a route such as BNE/SYD or SYD/MEL where there are QF flights every 30-60 mins, those not wishing to fly on a 717 can simply move their preferred departure time 30 mins either way ?
09 Jun 2017
Total posts 1
QF already fly 717s PER-ADL so not that big a change.
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 621
@Alxarora:
09 Jun 2017
Total posts 1
Just to clarify, the Q400 crew do get the same "perks" as their 737 counterparts, although granted the pay scales are much different, as is industry standard. The turboprops are wholly owned by QF, so they get all the same benefits as anyone else in the Qantas group. The 717 crews on the other hand get no such benefits, or protections for that matter. They are employed by cobham and are completely seperate to the Qantas group.
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 621
@Chris123:
QFF
19 Sep 2013
Total posts 202
As seems to be usual for QF, another downgrade that potentially will impact their transcon flights, as I believe that the spare 737s will gradually replace the 332s and 333s on the longer hauls to PER.
23 Oct 2014
Total posts 234
VA delaying Max arrival has nothing to do capital cash - smile, it's go to do with cheaper fuel than forecast and just like VA guess what QF have delayed their NEO arrivals because the fuel burn advantage has diminished for short term, goose and the gander same same for both airline groups - not VA specific
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
12 Jun 2011
Total posts 148
There are a number of leased VA 737-800s that have leases expiring to coincide with the original delivery of the 737max. Those leases will be extended depending on market conditions as they will now be short of aircraft.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
27 Nov 2014
Total posts 51
Will there be an impact on number of B717 services from CBR?
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
28 Jul 2016
Total posts 108
Very smart move! Hopefully I will get an opportunity to fly on one!
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
12 Sep 2014
Total posts 6
Have flown the Biz seats SYD/Maroochydore. Good experience, and love the quietness of engines on the tail.
15 Feb 2013
Total posts 163
The engines at the back are great ... unless you're sitting at the back! 😂
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
27 May 2017
Total posts 1
They say that they will have iPads for streaming in the seats but these were removed from Qantas Link flights out of Hobart nearly a year ago. Does this mean they are going to re-add these to their fleets?
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
06 Oct 2016
Total posts 161
I like the 717 as I use to go Brisbane-Rocky on it.
more comfortable and quieter than a 737 at both ends, the 2 seats are good as well.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
02 Apr 2017
Total posts 134
They've stopped using it to Rocky unfortunately, it's an all turboprop service (unless they've bought them back very recently). Meanwhile, Virgin is replacing their ATRs with 737s out of Rocky, and have had 737 service with IFE and business cabin for a long time now, giving them the edge over Qanta on that route.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
06 Oct 2016
Total posts 161
Thanks Dredgy It was a while back, I worked for Ergon on the retail side which gives you an idea on how long!!!
Use to avoid the dash service like the plague because of carry on
09 Jun 2017
Total posts 1
I had my first cancelled Qantas flight on Monday (BNE-ADL). It was due to mechanical issues with the 717. Not sure this is a great idea.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
21 Mar 2017
Total posts 37
I adore the eJets VA currently have which sneak into the triangle routes middle of day and late evening. Super sad they're going. Not flown a 717 since JQ ran them MEL-MCY about 2004/2005. Don't think this is a terrible idea... As most say, this will allow weekend 73's to replace weekend A330 flying which VA also does. $10 that the 330's will now do intl during weekend (like, a cheeky extra Fri + Sat night HKG or of the like... maybe a reinstallation of AKL-LAX since AA have reduced to seasonal etc...) Ahhh gotta love the airline business ;)
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
30 May 2013
Total posts 372
The 717 is a great aircraft to fly on. Wider seats than the 737 and 2-3 seating is great when flying with your partner - no centre seat! But, one toilet for 110 people in economy isn't ideal.
24 Apr 2015
Total posts 128
seat pitch does not equate to legroom. An aircraft with 30 inch seat pitch can have more legroom than an aircraft with 31 inch, if the former has modern seats with thin seat backs & the later has old seats with thick seat backs. Do the QF link 717's have original seats that may have been recovered at some stage ?
13 Sep 2016
Total posts 55
Really smart move, if there's not sufficient demand for the Boeing 737 then the Boeing 717 is a fair swap and as this article says, could ever be better for some flyers. I've flown in the QantasLink Boeing 717 quite a few times and it's a great little aircraft.
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 621
@John Odlum:
24 Apr 2015
Total posts 128
most consumers wouldn't know the difference between a 717 & a 737 !!!
If they used airbridges even less would notice.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
23 Oct 2013
Total posts 702
Obviously, there will be people complaining when such aircraft swaps do occur.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
18 Aug 2014
Total posts 72
Will Qantas drop there prices now ????
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
28 Oct 2011
Total posts 462
Why should they??? The 717 product is no different/worse from that on the 737. In fact, quite a few people prefer the 717.
24 Apr 2015
Total posts 128
supply & demand
No need to dump any seats cheap as there won't be any seats left to dump.
31 Aug 2016
Total posts 2
It would be nice to have a Qantas 738 on the Perth - Bali route. A lot of people do not want to fly on budget airlines especially as the starting point of a holiday.
01 May 2015
Total posts 7
Boeing should start manufacturing the 717 again
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
23 Oct 2013
Total posts 702
I doubt we'll see something like that. There are also many other planes that airlines including Qantas would want to be manufactured again. The Dash 8-200 and 300 comes into mind.
Virgin Australia - Velocity Rewards
24 Aug 2011
Total posts 785
Antonov AN-74 :)
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
23 Oct 2013
Total posts 702
Whilst the AN-74 has the range/pax numbers the next regional aircraft Qantas will want to look is something which can land on 1000m strips and the AN-74 needs 2000m.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
02 Apr 2017
Total posts 134
I agree, there is - I think - a strong business case for it. It might be a hard sell initially, but I think everyone who's bought it has loved it, and it has incredibly high passenger satisfaction ratings.
I'm pretty sure QF would order more, as would many others - it was just a bad time for aviation when the 717 faced the chopping block.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
28 Jul 2016
Total posts 108
I agree, a re engined 717 with split wingtips would be great. Unfortunately, I don't see that happening.
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 621
@Rons47:
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
06 Oct 2016
Total posts 161
More likely Q would get a Bombardier CS
Did it Zurich to Madrid and a nice flight in 1a (you get the b seat vacant) but they don't have the rear mount engines which makes the 717 so nice for a narrow body
28 Nov 2012
Total posts 93
Deadset, i miss the 767.....more room less frequency on a weekend....chose when you fly and what aircraft
28 Nov 2012
Total posts 93
so the B717 are getting realy old, like retro old.......what's the replacement?
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
06 Oct 2016
Total posts 161
Realistically the Bombardier CS100/300
Just doesn't have the rear engine (which makes the 717 so nice and quiet) but not a bad narrow body, did 1A Zurich-Madrid with the vacant B seat of euro business and it was better than a Euro 737 - not saying much...
21 Jul 2011
Total posts 90
I love the 717 so hope I can get one. I go out of my way to fly them and QF have done a good job of the refurb.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
12 Jan 2017
Total posts 5
We flew Sydney Hobart return in a 717 in February 2016 and the 2 part of 2-3 seats works really well for a couple. Also flew HNL to Big Island Hawaii in 2014 as a family of 5 and again no issues. Very vague memories of flying an Alitalia DC9 circa 1972.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
10 May 2014
Total posts 20
This is a great way to try out the 717 for a very cheap price for Brisbane based flyers... The golden triangle fares are generally cheaper than the regional qld 717 flights.....
31 Jan 2013
Total posts 43
QF love the 717 and snap up any good ones that come on to the market. They are very reliable and cheap to maintain. I don't know how VA is going to cope without the E190s to compete with the 717s. They've already had to drop routes like SYD/MKY and are operating routes like SYD/CFS with 737s that are vastly to big for the route. They need something that is in between the ATR, which is slow and not a patch on the Q400, and the 737.I guess their only answer is to grab all the F100s they can to try to match the 717s but they'd need to reconfigure them with a J cabin.
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